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Topics - devia
1
Tonight they will be announcing their divorce. Not sure how many have followed this saga but my daughter said to me today....she is a great role model for me to remember that I never ever will become like her.
I do think this series will be opening up a lot of eyes regarding how some men are treated/abused by their wives.
2
No topic, no comment about what a great dad your dads are or were on Fathers day.
I have had a great dad. When I was a kid mom didn't allow sweets in the house but it was dad's job to go grocery shopping on Saturdays. In season I'd sit through football with him then we'd do the shopping, which meant sneaking sweets into the house which we'd leave in his wood shop. My kids also enjoyed this ritual with him, I now know that mom knew all along but decided to just let it be, it was our time.
Dad had issues with not letting girls do boy stuff, (even today he asked my 14 year old son to show his 22 year old sister how to work a window), but he also excepted every choice myself and my brothers made for ourselves without criticism, he's always just been there for us. My brothers and I brought home some pretty crazy friends in my parents eyes over the years, never once did he say they were not welcome.
How about some positive dad stories?
3
A can of bear spray was broken in a Canadian Tire store (like a home depot) I was in today. I got there about 8 minutes after it happened. I was warned going in to not go in, but I had (wanted) to so I did. People were coughing and wheezing, and there was a distinct odor in the air. I got my stuff and left within 10 minutes. I guess I have decent lung health, it was unpleasant but not enough to make me cough or wheeze.
So they closed it down right after for the night, 50-80 thousand sq feet with high ceilings (or so). That is powerful stuff.
6
A McCain/Clinton ticket will be pretty much voting for the same person (they're even good friends). Perhaps it's time to get behind Obama as the democratic choice?
Interesting how tonight's vote went down. In most states where he won Obama won by a huge margin, except for California Clinton slide by on a 10% or less win.
7
<<<If a man held autonomy to be a key aim in life he would never marry and never consent to an active fatherhood. Marriage and fatherhood lock men into a life of work and responsibility in which there is rarely time or money for a man to do as he pleases.>>>
In what ways are women able to choose between a life for themselves and a life of responsibility?
This article says men choose to be husbands and fathers. Does not the choice of motherhood and marriage also lock women into a life of responsibility?
Why would a woman consent to motherhood considering the responsibilities? WHy not do as they please?
To me this article devalues what men bring to fatherhood, in an odd way.
8
I've just finished reading this book.
Before reading it the only thing I knew about it was that it was banned in schools for using the word nigger. (I wince using that word...but dammit I will)
I did not know about the social changes that came about because of this book. I did not know about the radical ideas brought forth in this book that Lincoln himself was inspired by. After reading it I spent time researching it and frankly I'm in awe of it's author.
I'm not an American, so I assume that the reading of this book is less prevalent in Canada. It's said that this book has been the most highly read book except for the bible.
I have a question, ....who hasn't read it/ who has? And more importantly like myself thought it was a racist text because of the banning?
9
Anyone here spent any time there? Found any neat out of the way (away from the throngs of tourists) freindly pubs or restaurants, etc?
If so I'd be grateful if you PM'd me. Leaving Monday morning but I'll be contected there as well.
10
I read on a feminst site today that women were also hero's on 9/11 but the media just discounted them
So I googled the claim and found out that the flight attendents on flight 93 have been documented boiling water in order to throw on to the terrorists.
Part of me had to laugh at the whole boiling water thing, but yeah you use what's at your disposal.
But then there was this qoute from the extreme Christian right:
"He later said, "She said her flight had been hijacked by guys with knives. We are here in the back trying to get hot water to throw on them. Do you have any other ideas? She and several of the other flight attendants were filling coffeepots with boiling water-to throw at the hijackers. (A really smart way to initiate a fight, I must say!)"
Sometimes I think you are dammed if you try.
http://www.pathlights.com/Flight%2093.htm
11
As most of you know I spent a few years in juvie.
Here's the story of one kid I knew.
He was a gas/solvent abuser. when I first met him at about 13 or so, his lower face looked burnt to a crisp and he had the congitive abilities of perhaps a 2nd grader.
That kid is now a lawyer. How amazing is that?
He was taken in as a foster kid by a guy who in his spare time ran the ironman competiton locally. I would say "Big Al" kick some major butt regarding this kid. He took him out to a farm, made him work hard and turned his life around.
The idea of prisons for profit turns my stomach. I don't care about vengence what I do care about is making people healthy enough so they can be productive members of society.
In the case above let's run the senerio minus Big Al. Al took him in at 14 and got 600$? a month for taking care of him. If he had stayed at the juvie I was in the costs were 24 hundred a kid per month.
No doubt he would have been in jail for the rest of his life when he wasn't a street person.
I'm a diehard capitalist. Big Al saved me money by saving that kid.
12
I believe my post was on topic. Finding information has to include the varibles involved.
As I said if I was a judge where I live I would be more likely to give a prison sentence to a man then a woman knowing the enviroment they would be going into.
But I also know the States has a much different system, prisons for profit must come into play as far as sentencing goes. Perhaps men get longer sentences in part because the prisons make money from their free labor? Again I don't know but I do wonder.
Again, from the limited knowledge I have in the U.S I believe men have it much worse in prison. But there also could Winnipegs's in the U.S as well.
13
I'm going to use a statement from another MRA website, I'm not going to link to it because cross posting has been discouraged for good reason, but if asked I can provide a link.
My question would be what does being a MRA mean?
Does it mean women are equal with equal responsibility?
Does is mean men and women have equal responsibilty but are different with their own positive and negative general traits?
Does it mean men are superior/and or have more positive traits then women?
<<<<I think what this men's right's party is trying to accomplish is simply "equality" between the genders. There are a lot of men who believe that if society would just treat women and men as equals, instead of giving preferential treatment to women, then society would be as good as humanly possible. I suppose the thinking is that these men think that they can appeal to women from a sense of "equality", but that is their first mistake because women are not equal to men in any sense of the word equal. Women are like little children, they must be bounded and restricted by men and societal laws. Thus, trying to appeal to women to stop special treatment for women, from a sense of "equality", is like a man trying to get his 6 year old child to stop eating only ice cream all day long from a sense of "nutrition". The 6 year old knows nothing about nutrition, and even if you educated the 6-year old about nutrition, there's little chance any 6 year old would care about nutrition given the taste of ice cream. Likewise, women know nothing about "equality", "fairness", or "justice", thus even if you try to educate women about these concepts, there's little chance any significant number of women would care about these concepts given the sweet taste of preferential treatment. The only course seems to be, the women will become drunk with power and preferential treatment until America collapses under a mountain of debts, and all of America will be enslaved to the debtholders, much like the 6-year old without parental authority will keep eating ice cream until the child grows into a 700-pound adult and dies at age 29 from a diabetic influenced heart-attack. This is why I've long contended, that granting women the right to vote without the corresponding responsibility to be be drafted and sent to serve in all-female front-line combat units, was the beginning of the preferential treatment for women, and the beginning of the fall of the American Republic. From the very beginning of the "women's rights" movement, until this day, it has never been about "equality", it has always been and always will be about "preferential treatment" for women, because women are by nature no different than little children.>>>
14
I'm considering putting in my hat for the second area assistant manager, there's a few ( I thought only couple) of things I'll have to change regarding what I bring to my job if I want to step up to the next level. Believe it or not spelling and grammar doesn't make the list
I've gotten a reputation for being very detailed orientated, for caring as much for administration as I do for sales, for respecting management, and for getting along with all my co-workers. I've been the biggest supporter of the first assistant manager hired whose was my old partner, the guys a hard-ass, in the best possible way... do your job right and he's your biggest fan, if not you'll hear about it. Thats what I think a leader should be.
In the last few months they gave me team leadership in a store that's been sinking. Last month we had the highest growth rate of any store in the company since it started (can I say proud).
Ok... long post.
I'm realistic, and I believe that whatever job you take on you have take on 100%. There are more then a few people who have asked to be put into the management gear who are responsible for misorders, who can't click with their co-workers, or are unable to orginize.
I do all three, but there are two things I will have to change about myself if I decide to be in management. Not things that have been pointed out to me but the ovious things I get away with just being in sales.
One would be my clothing. For the most part I semi-dress for sucess, I dress pretty much like a punk/goth gurl forced into adult clothing. Not crossing the line but putting a slight edge into what I wear.
If I want this it's tailored suits from now on. No more tailored suits with a subtle studed collar for an accent, I'll be going hard core vanilla/straight.
Next would be gossip. I will have to cut off snickering about anyone to anyone besides other management (I'm close enough to them I know they do it too... but you have to keep it within lines). I'm ok with that. But I'll miss it.
The one that I didn't think of was the phone call I had today. A female co-worker who I'm pretty close to overheard me discussing the pro's and con's of me going for this with my old parter/ now management (the guy with six kids). No one except managment was to know I'm considering it, but she overheard the conversation.
So she called me with a concern. Her concern is that she thinks the boss is horny for me, she said I'd be great in the position but I need to consider what that could do to his career if he was involved within a scandal. IE: It doesn't matter what I've done, I've fucked my way to the top.
I am somewhat pissed. I really like my boss, he's a good boss. And dammit I do my job well and I do believe except for perhaps one person I am the best candidate.
I also know she wanted management but is not suited for it. But in the end she's a person who will say it to my face at least, so in the end I don't just have to deal with a clothing change and a delete of any gossip on my part I'll probaly have to deal with the people that don't like me as much as she does thinking the same thing or worse.
If I decide to put myself up for this promotion it will be because I know I can do the job well. But it sucks that even though my numbers should speak for themselves someone who wants the job for themselves can pull out bullshit about how I make the boss horny. Bull, but if it came down to a few candidates no doubt you would take the one with the least issues.
Question
(btw anyone who gets though to the question deserves a medal)
You as guys.. what sort of things have your coworkers used, to say that you don't deserve the promotion?
15
I know that's an odd title, but Paris getting out of jail reminded me of an article I read the The Times, and that article reminded me of one of the reasons why I believe my kids turned out as darn good as they are.
In a nut shell the article was about preteen girls being very much in the know regarding the celebrity goings on of our most outlandish celebritites. They interviewed a bunch of them and not one wasn't disgusted by them. When asked who they admired not one answered with a "shank" (although I'd rather use the phrase "clueless idiot who needs serious help"). Tops of their lists were celebrities who are taking on and getting know for taking on humanitarian efforts.
So this got me to thinking about my own familes history, starting with my grandfather. My granduncle was Thomas Hicks (go ahead and google the name with the Olumpics if you so wish), joined at the hip my grandfather was even more of a maverick, goldminer, inventor, and all around drunken crazy happy fool.
My dads probaly the most careful conservative (though he has socialist leanings having been almost starved to death during the depression) person you'd ever meet. He's so law abiding it took us a couple of years for him to convice him he wasn't breaking the law by taping t.v with his VCR. Him and mom married in their mid 30's and they were the only people each other had dated.
Then me, well I took from my dad the never stealing, being respectful of your elders thing but I certainly rebeled any other way I could. (I also got from him being longwinded regarding story telling). As I've said before my brother who was also adopted and who has alchol syndrome got into prositution as a youth and I followed him quickly behind. Our upperclass white bred society we were joined to didn't stop us from rebeling against every part of that. Pretty much anything a neo-conservative is against we took part in. Ten years in the leather community for myself with the pictures to prove it.
So why did my kids turn out ok, and dare I say it conservative?
Part of it would be simple rebellion. My dad rebelled from his dad by being the opposite of him, I rebelled by being the opposite of my dad, my kids rebelled against me by being conservative etc.
But I think my kids also had a leg up, I think this because my brothers kid didn't turn out the same way as mine. His kid is a stupid teen mom whose lucky enough that the dad's parents are ethnic and taking care of the baby, she'll be lucky to finish highschool. (not to say I did, I just also got a work ethic from my dad)
I think the leg up my kids had was the introduction of my foster daughter. Ten or so years older then they were, and heavily involved with gangs and prositution when my kids were just starting their tweens they watched Wendy make huge mistakes in her life without the abilty to join in. It seems they procesed the information and decided they didn't want to be like her. They've also watched while she put herself back together. Hence I have two girls who the last thing they'd want is to go through what she went though, their able to make clear moral choices because they know the outcome of both.
So in conclusion I do believe that the Paris Hiltons of the world may be a positive role model for the next generation, because who the heck would want to be like them? I see her as a role model for what you don't want to be, let's hope these tweens in the survey carry their feelings on the their teens and beyound,
16
It's not often I start a topic, but I had something happen this last week that made me wonder what is really pissing "you guys" off.
Senerio 1 : Stupid young woman marries the bad boy. Their life is a mess, she's stuck with the kids while he's out with the boys, eventually the marriage or cohabitation or non of the above fails because one of you had to grow up to take care of the kids..he's in jail or otherwise not in the picture , and she's a single mom either doing well or fucking up.
Senerio 2: (the last was pretty generic, this will be more point by point because I've witnessed it in the last few months)
You've gotten a promotion and talked about it with your wife (not taken a promotion or bought a house without asking your wife if she was ok with it).
It's a given that the first year you'll be lucky to get a full day off, your cell phone will always be on. That's been discussed, the pro's outweigh the con's.
But a couple of months in the "at home spouse" decides they're upset at all the hours your spending at work. You get cell phone calls from your two year old at biz meetings with your child asking when you'll be home.
So my question would be, I assume most everyone here has met someone from senerio two... a few of us from senerio one. Whose the better person in the long run?
I'm asking this because I've know woman who never had the option of a dad, and as many screw ups as I've seen I've also seen them beat those odds and support their kids to a much higher standard of living then they had themselves.
But now I'm in upperly mobileville, and although most of the marriages around me are good and fair there is a couple which really piss me off. Allowing (making) a two year old to phone Daddy and make him feel guilty for being at a dinner meeting REALLY pissed me off. Your thoughts?
17
Honestly I think perhaps this co-worker and I this weird karma thing going. Three years and we've hit heads over more issues then I have with everyone else combined in my lifetime (this is the same guy who assured me that my sister-inlaw would get off her death bed because he prayed for her).
I like the guy, honest, but could someone give me some realistic stats for him?
He's 49. his wife is 45, last year they were in marrige consuling and today he's of the belief they will be adopting at any moment a healthy white baby or at least a toddler.
They signed up (5 thousand later) with the idea they would be getting a perfectly healthy baby right away. I've tried applying to his realistic side (dude no way I woukd admit to what I ingested when I was a teen mom) only to have him counter with most birth mothers are 21+
I don't want to burst his bubble.
Are there stats out there that I can show them without being the bad guy that they should'nt be tossing good money over bad, is there someone who has taken upon themselves to record in someway adoption stats?
18
I'm somewhat a believer. I believe in one God but I don't believe he came to a select group of people as his only son. Consider me a agnostic who would not want to gain admitance to heaven if my Buddhist neighbors would be denied.
One of my co-workers- a born again decided to take it upon himself to start a prayer circle for my kid (whose partner happens to be Buddhist) and for my sister-in-law, whose probaly a pagan though I've never had a chance to ask,nor do I really care.
I like my co-worker very much, I don't want to offend him by being offended but frankly asking me the first name of the person afflicted and him telling me they will be ok because his praying group has said so is really offensive to me/the people afflicted on some level. My husband says that any good thought is good, don't over think it and just be gracious.
I can agree with that, but part of me wants to ask if my co-worker whose looking to adopt a child would be ok with a pagan ritual that thinks good thoughts regarding their adoption also. I asked him and his responce was "what do you mean?"
19
My husband and I took out what we can only call our "we wish" family for a high-end dinner a couple of nights ago.
It was a six hour sit down meal, while waiting for the main course "dad" had what I immediately recognized a pretty major panic attack. First touching the face, then crossing the arms, fidgeting in his seat, and in the end walking out saying he had to leave NOW.
My husband and my "I wish" brother went outside with him, got him smiling (distracted from anxiety) and eventually brought him back for the last course. (Looking back on myself I can't believe he was able to do that)
"Dad" sent us a letter apologizing for ruining our evening.
A big part of me wants to sit down and have a long talk with him about what it was like for me being afraid to go to the grocery store vs how many times he opted out of years in Europe in the past because of our shared condition. ("Dad" is pretty much filthy rich, I'm middle class, hence the difference in lost experiences)
He's in his 60's and I'm just starting on my 40's. I've been to Europe six times now and he never has Both his kids were schooled there for university and "mom "(who by the way... they love each other more then any couple I've ever met) flew back and forth to see them. "Dad" can't do planes.
I have the same problem as he does. Big time. When I was young (20ish) I fainted 3+ times a week. I hate to do the pity thing but I couldn't go for coffee at my neighbor's house. They check out the vital organs, put me in a placebo study, ran me through every test they could. In the end with a combination of breathing techniques, herbals and the occasion pill under the tongue I'm actually in sales! Not to mention being able to travel, enjoy life, and no problem going for coffee.
My husband and I are at in impasse regarding how to respond to his letter. My husband sees any response that acknowledges his condition at his age to be an unneeded slap to his male pride., his response in a nut shell would be " You have nothing to apologize for, you company was greatly appreciated",
No doubt I would completely agree that his company was enough for me and/or us. I know that when I had the huge panic attacks anyone mentioning the word would set them off. I also know there's no one else in his family that could sit down and really talk about it except me,
Not being vain here, "mom's" had a couple of strokes, bro's a bit of a life is easy drunk (why we love him) and sis and my husband both think the way they do.
So "dad" is 60ish. Would you try your best to get him taking his condition medically or just except him and leave it?
20
You're 18 years old with no means of support except your part time job at Tacotime.
You're pregnant and the dad falls into catagories. He could be anything between long term boyfreind where things are moving ahead of schedule to you having no idea who it might be.
You have choices but they are restricted by peer preasure. If dad's your boyfreind then you'll talk about choices. If not you have two choices and one of them involves having someone you know nothing about being in your life pretty much forever. The third choice- adoption is pretty much ruled out because frankly it makes you unpopular and you have to agree with it wih dad if there is one.
Canadian welfare moms routinely tell welfare workers they have no idea who the father is.
There is a reason for that. If there is a named father welfare benifits are paid through him first. He pays welfare (child support) then welfare pays mom. If he doesn't pay then there is a delay while it goes through the proper channels, could be a month or so. Much easier to say that there is no dad, cuts down on paperwork.
