"the Code"..

Started by drex, Jul 10, 2009, 08:18 AM

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What are your feelings regarding a "code" to promote unity and improve effectiveness?

Good idea, and I would like to partake..
2 (50%)
Sounds good in theory, but I am not yet ready to partake
1 (25%)
Neutral, no opinion one way or the other
1 (25%)
No, not a good idea
0 (0%)

Total Members Voted: 4

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drex

During the year of 2009, some debate has gone on regarding the merits of developing a "code" that could be used by folk to help promote unity, reduce the risk of divisiveness that affects the movement badly, and generally, promote good practice for activists of the cause..

The following poll is asking for opinions on this, and it is requested that future discussion on the code be focused in this thread for ease of referrence, moderation, etc..
Not tonight josephine..

dr e

Before we can vote we need to know what you mean by "code."  What is it?  How does it work?  How would it be implemented?
Contact dr e  Lifeboats for the ladies and children, icy waters for the men.  Women have rights and men have responsibilties.

drex

Good question, I was reccomended to come here to introduce the idea of "the code", it has been discussed more on the antimisandry site and on chris keys' mens rights online forum..

The beauty of "the code" is that it is to be created/developed/implemented and disciplined by the folk who will agree to work to it..


Some initial "bare bones" work has already been done by a few folk working together, and it has been seen that what has been created so far is very much in line with the sort of "standard good practice" used in many successful business groups..

But, I am going to hang fire on releasing the initial "foundation" work until we get more idea of what folk think of the whole concept of such a code..


What I will say, for now, is the foundations of a succesful code that can be used have to begin in "communication standards"..

Right now, we are interested in seeing if there is an interest in the concept, if there is a sense of optimism, or indeed pessimism that such a project could have a positive impact..

Not tonight josephine..

dr e

I can't comment on something that is a mystery.  The concept of having some sort of unifying document sounds like a great idea but it all depends on the content.  Tell us something about what it says and how it will work and that will facilitate some discussion.
Contact dr e  Lifeboats for the ladies and children, icy waters for the men.  Women have rights and men have responsibilties.

drex

So you wish to see what has been created so far, even though the principle of whether it is worth creating such a document is the basis of this poll, in the same way that before the house is built or a foundation laid, it is good to see if the land is suitable..

This is what we have so far..

It is of course not set in stone, it is simply the starting point..

http://the-code.wikispaces.com/

Not tonight josephine..

drex

Not tonight josephine..

dr e

From the little I have seen it appears that you are trying to set up an organization with rules of conduct.  While this may have great value it doesn't seem to address the problem you originally presented which was getting the present groups to cooperate and work together. 
Contact dr e  Lifeboats for the ladies and children, icy waters for the men.  Women have rights and men have responsibilties.

drex

I think the key to co-operation is effective communication. Other facets of the code are to be developed, that will be aimed at finding ways to allow folk with differring ideas and methods to concentrate more on what unites them than what divides them..
Not tonight josephine..

fschmidt


From the little I have seen it appears that you are trying to set up an organization with rules of conduct.  While this may have great value it doesn't seem to address the problem you originally presented which was getting the present groups to cooperate and work together. 


This is a good point and I think it needs to be clarified.  The goal of the Code is not to set up an organization.  The goal is create a set of rules that will enable other groups to cooperate and work together more effectively.  This is why the Code does not contain any statement of values.  It is only a set of rules for being effective.  The only purpose of the organization behind the Code is to update the Code itself.  All other MRA activity will be done in other organizations.  An existing organization can use the Code for itself and ask its members to agree to it.  This should help the organization become more effective.

My first reaction to the idea of the code was negative.  I thought, why focus on a code instead of building up a useful organization by increasing membership?  But then I realized that the problem is not a lack of MRAs.  The problem is that most MRAs are incapable of committing to any real action.  So in fact, the Code goes right to the heart of the problem.

Drex and I have very different ideas about the ideal solution to fighting feminism.  So outside of the Code, we would probably belong to different organizations.  But because of the Code, I feel that I can count on Drex.  I would rather deal with Drex, whose ideas are very different from mine, than deal with someone who agrees with me completely but in whom I have no reason to trust.  This is what the Code is about.
Biblic Judaism because modern culture is evil

dr e

I agree with what you are saying but my sense is that men will not be motivated to join a group such as the one being suggested.  What is in it for them? 

You think we have enough MRA's?  I wish I could agree with that one!  What I see are chivalrous automatons who don't have a clue that their balls are in a vice and it is being tightened.
Contact dr e  Lifeboats for the ladies and children, icy waters for the men.  Women have rights and men have responsibilties.

fschmidt

I don't expect most MRAs to join the Code.  I expect a very small minority to join.  The idea is to find those MRAs who are committed enough to join without there being any personal benefit.  Even a small group is much better than isolated individuals.

You are right in that most people will only join something when there is something in it for them.  So this is the challenge for the founders of most groups, to figure out what personal benefit they can offer to attract members.  The Code group doesn't have this issue because we don't need many members.  But other MRA group founders will face this question, and the Code group would be a great place to discuss ideas to solve this.

I think it's important to remember that it only takes very small groups of men to change the world.  The most influential men in Western history were probably Plato and Christ, and they both led very small groups whose ideas were completely out of sync with the mainstream.  But these groups grew over time.  This is why I think there are enough MRAs right now, probably far more than the initial followers of Plato and Christ.  The only issue is the level of commitment.
Biblic Judaism because modern culture is evil

drex


I agree with what you are saying but my sense is that men will not be motivated to join a group such as the one being suggested.  What is in it for them? 

You think we have enough MRA's?  I wish I could agree with that one!  What I see are chivalrous automatons who don't have a clue that their balls are in a vice and it is being tightened.


I see the same problem, men dont know what the situation is till the vice finally crushed their balls..

There are too few MRA's and too few active ones..

The code is a "tool" to improve effectiveness, to assist the mra's in their work, it will be a good tool for those who seek to lead their own groups, which we need more of..
Not tonight josephine..

dr e

I am all for any tool that will help men wake up or to aid them in standing up for their own interests. 
Contact dr e  Lifeboats for the ladies and children, icy waters for the men.  Women have rights and men have responsibilties.

outdoors

#13
Jul 13, 2009, 11:21 AM Last Edit: Jul 13, 2009, 02:43 PM by outdoors


i just do not think that men can depend on men anymore-i am hoping that u can prove me wrong--but in my experience that is highly unlikely.

drex


i like what dr e has stated with his concerns as to what will be required from members of this"code"-what type of activism-what?when?where?how?.


i believe i have stated the same concerns somewhere in the past


i also think that men will scatter when it comes right down to it.

i know u think i am against this code drex...but thats just not true...i am open to it and am watching the the way things are developing with it

i just do not think that men can depend on men anymore-i am hoping that u can prove me wrong--but in my experience that is highly unlikely.


I dont think you aree "against" the idea, I think you have a high level of cynicism as to what it can achieve, which, I very much  share actually, but, its about taking opportunities, even though they may amount to nothing..

It may prove to be a useful tool, or not, but there is nothing to lose, I think, other than time, which most folk waste on the forums anyway..


In answer to the question, all that is asked of the folk who wish to help in the development of the code is that they keep up the dialogue and see where it goes..
Not tonight josephine..

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