Well, then again

[Mr. X]

As far a Griffin, some like her, but most of what I've seen of her stimulates my gag reflex.  In my opinion, she strives for vulgar, outrageous, shock jock, "comedy" and seems to be able find an audience by playing that.

Yes and she screwed Levi just to get trash on Palin then dumped Ricky when he was of no use. I keep hearing how Bristol is the "bad girl" here but Levi doesn't appear to make any honest efforts. Selling family secrets for $$, gossiping about the family, sleeping with d-list liberals who hate Palin with a passion, making no attempts to just be with his son.... I don't see those as signs of a guy who's been ripped off. If anything he got ripped off by the left who milked him dry, chucked him out AFTER he sold out the Palin's in the process. He's a player.

[The Gonzman]

Sorry but since I don't see /watch or have a TV I am not privy to the so called inside story which many folks base their assumptions on. However my comment was made to poise rhetorically the daily onslaught we face of how bad men and boys are in the world today and just how we got here. Right or wrong good or bad these behaviors we see portrayed are a direct consequences of the vacuum of influence men have in raising children. Even the out of the box thinking that provided you with ammunition has been mostly lost to today's generation. Again, I've never met anyone that would even privately claim to have been a bad parent yet socially we are injured and getting worse not better. From my arm chair I can't see how social commentary on individual behavior can get much worse - we already know it will due to the loss of civility but I'm sure you will agree boys don't become men through osmosis. Today's boys are raised on a steady diet of TV, video games and the internet  all of which have no moral conscious....did I mention fatherless. We shouldn't be giving anyone a free pass for bad behavior but any social judgment has to remember how we got to this place.

"If" by Rudolf Kipling

DLove

As a father, I remember when my kids would fuck up and get in the shit.  And of course, there were always excuses, and reasons, and stories, and rationalizations.

And as a father, you know what I told them?

"That doesn't mean anything.  The issue is that you did wrong."

And you can be sure that my daughter tried the "I'm a girl so it's different for me" trick, and I didn't let that fly for a nanosecond.  The first time she tried it I laid the question, "So does that mean since you're a girl you're a moral retard?" across her like a whipcrack.

People like Levi Johnston hurt us.  No matter how much they hate Palin, you can bank your next month's paycheck that Amanda Marcotte, Jessica Valenti, Hugo Schwyzer, et al are filing his shit away, and will break it out in a hot minute - using Bristol Palin for their own ends - and say "See?  See?  See? Men behaving badly!  See?"

And if we're defending him, we're open to charges of hypocrisy.

Well, Levi, I'm very sorry you had a bad childhood, no father to speak of, and a crack whore for a mother.  But that doesn't mean anything.  The issue is that you did wrong.

[Virtue]

Jesus he fucked Kathy Griffin?!!?!?!?!?!

How the hell did he keep it up?.......How in the hell can you  stand next to anyone who had sex with  one of the biggest man bashing feminist leftist/celebrities in the industry of leftist/celebrities, how can you do that in the context of an MRA, or a Libertarian or any lover of freedom?

[The Gonzman]

Jesus he fucked Kathy Griffin?!!?!?!?!?!

How the hell did he keep it up?.......How in the hell can you  stand next to anyone who had sex with  one of the biggest man bashing feminist leftist/celebrities in the industry of leftist/celebrities, how can you do that in the context of an MRA, or a Libertarian or any lover of freedom?

Morgan says it better than I could.

http://www.peekinthewell.net/blog/palin-go-round/#comments

[Mr. X]

I think Alinksy's #11 and #13 come to mind here.

[DLove]

    Cool and I give you kudos and respect for your command of self responsibilities - but while your personal accolades are an admirable trait of self reflection that is not what what I am professing- at least I hope it doesn't appear that I am. While I do agree, each gender should be responsible for self behavior it is the learning of the consequences of particular behavior patterns that is lacking in modern society - that is my premise and while everyone seems to be mimicking what they see and hear in the various medias your personal postulations while right and true for you, seems to be lacking in the societal social consciousness. As the roles of men and women boys and girls have changed, been smudged, been redefined or even disappeared; where can one find morals or solid life wisdom that isn't nuvue or a self appreciating modern twist? There are no excuses for ones bad behavior, but responsibility, or lacking a necessity of it is devoid here and there, I only bring attention to the cause not the effect. While certainly there are those amongst us that have advocated just how things should be in world of "personal responsibility", the truth is, that is an idea. The real world is a "guns for what you can get mentality". Who really gives a flying crap whether Levi is seen as a out control male with parenting issues or a product of a system that has created men/boys that when faced with adult responsibilities tend to be just a bit or a lot flaky. The problem if it can be called a problem is that before him (Levi) we have created a society where his primal instincts, to love and protect his own has been eviscerated (immorally and illegally) leaving him and many many other beta males like him to reign non nonchalantly on the edge of the herd with nothing personally invested. Do we blame him? Is that not the safest place to be for man/boy in this society?
   
If I was attentive at my father knee, I should know that this dilemma is easily fixable, except in a society where men, especially strong and opinionated men of good character are not wanted and valued. So the Levis' and his kind are what we get as smut...... But the force that commands this exile is far worse and should be the focus of our (men) attention. Lets not bicker about who must get up or how hey must get up nor the means each uses to weld his stick "just get the heck up and get to it."

 If the apple doesn't fall far from the tree" quote is true,  I repeat myself, I know of no one who would admit to being a bad parent even the Oprah crowd of women folk that believe they are doing "the best job a single parent can do" which by any logically thinking persons standards has been a piss poor, the results is our current paradigm of "the consequences of fatherlessness." We are human after all and not mistake proof.  

DLove

[The Gonzman]

The problem is a lack of shame.

Don't stick out.  Don't rock the boat.  Don't judge.  Who are you to__________?  It's everywhere, the meme to blend in, to not excel.  Consensus.  Right and wrong be damned, compromise in the name of being "moderate" or some other namby-pamby, cowardly, panty-waist bullshit.

You pegged it.  We are in a society where strong and opinionated men of character, of accomplishment, sheepdogs as opposed to wolves, who dare to say "You did wrong, this is wrong, this ends here" are not valued.  In fact, they are dismissed, mocked, and scorned and slandered as patriarchs, tyrants, aggressors, bullies and oppressors.

Because they don't want to have to face these men, pointing their finger, and saying "Shame on you."   They fear the disapproving look because they know they deserve it.  They want these men silent because they know that in the final analysis they are weighed, and measured, and are found wanting.

In short - there are no fathers. 

[DLove]

As always you have and elegant albeit unorthodox yet entertaining command of the English language that we all enjoy and we can agree just how far down this road fatherlessness and it's ramifications has taken us. The proof is in the pudding. Can't Find My Way Home - Eric Clapton

DLove