Domestic violence program report

[kal147]

Roy Wrote:

I humbly suggest you consider the "rope-a-dope" strategy at this point.

Roy's probably right. Just finish the program get your certificate of completion ... then run like a thief in the night. You can do more and better activism against these terrible programs after you get out.

[Assault]

My server crashed yesterday just when I started posting those links....sorry for the delay.....here are the rest.

http://www.breakoutofthebox.com/circle.htm

http://www.stevecolwell.com/7habits.html

http://www.profitadvisors.com/win-win.shtml They pretty much use everything on this site

[Assault]

http://www.thenetteam.net/abused.html

[Awakened]

http://www.thenetteam.net/abused.html

A very subjective list here. I get the impression that any emotion at all could be considered abuse. :?

[Mr. Bad]

I've been thinking about this and have come to the conclusion that this may be our way to mortally would - if not outright kill - the feminist movement once and for all.

Consider that much of the funding for so-called "domestic violence services" actually is siphoned off to other projects that all loosely work together to promote and advance "feminism" as we know it today.  What would happen if not only the funding dried-up, but if we could actually bankrupt many of these organizations?  I think that would effectively destroy the feminist infrastructure and thus the movement itself.  And I think I have a plan on how to do it:

Let's look at the cases against the tobacco companies as a model.  The crux of the cases were that 1) the companies colluded with each other to hide the real facts for their own financial gain, and 2) smokers were harmed by this collusion and misrepresentation of the truth.   The same is happening in the realm of the DV industry: 1) Feminists have been colluding to hide the truth about DV, and 2) men like Assault, et al., have been directly harmed by this.  I think that the parallels are very close and that a good energetic team of attorneys could formulate a major class-action lawsuit against the many, many organizations involved in the DV industry.  I think that like the tobacco suits, they could use RICO to prosecute and probably win based on the precedent set by those victories.  And while we may not be able to get the entities in government, but I'd we sure as hell could take on the NGOs and other non-governmental ones.  

Any enterprising lawyers out there ready to take this on and shut these people down, and perhaps make a tidy sum in the process?  :grin:

[Assault]

I've been thinking about this and have come to the conclusion that this may be our way to mortally would - if not outright kill - the feminist movement once and for all.

Consider that much of the funding for so-called "domestic violence services" actually is siphoned off to other projects that all loosely work together to promote and advance "feminism" as we know it today.  What would happen if not only the funding dried-up, but if we could actually bankrupt many of these organizations?  I think that would effectively destroy the feminist infrastructure and thus the movement itself.  And I think I have a plan on how to do it:

Let's look at the cases against the tobacco companies as a model.  The crux of the cases were that 1) the companies colluded with each other to hide the real facts for their own financial gain, and 2) smokers were harmed by this collusion and misrepresentation of the truth.   The same is happening in the realm of the DV industry: 1) Feminists have been colluding to hide the truth about DV, and 2) men like Assault, et al., have been directly harmed by this.  I think that the parallels are very close and that a good energetic team of attorneys could formulate a major class-action lawsuit against the many, many organizations involved in the DV industry.  I think that like the tobacco suits, they could use RICO to prosecute and probably win based on the precedent set by those victories.  And while we may not be able to get the entities in government, but I'd we sure as hell could take on the NGOs and other non-governmental ones.  

Any enterprising lawyers out there ready to take this on and shut these people down, and perhaps make a tidy sum in the process?  :grin:

That is certainly an interesting idea, and one I had thought about already. The problem would be financial harship for a guy like me....I simply couldn't afford the fight...but maybe someone with either power or money will take up this cause someday.

[LSBeene]

Hey Assault,

Just looking at one site and gonna dissect it here for your benefit.

Answering the following questions will help you to determine whether or not you are in an emotionally abusive love relationship. A "YES" answer to even half of these questions indicates that you are in an emotionally abusive love relationship.

Ok, let's see how objective versus subjective this is.  Also, let's see how often (if ever) they as the respondant if THEY do these actions.

Do you feel like a child in the relationship, having to ask permission and apologizing for your behavior? Do you feel powerless and "less than" your lover or mate?

First off notice how they link behavior to behavior so that if the woman even has to apologize for inappropriate behavior he's "abusive".  And how often does one spouse need to "inform" the other spouse as to their whereabouts and what they are doing.  I'm SO SURE if I were to tell my wife: "Going out, back later" all the time she would rightfully be suspicious of my activities as I am not keeping her informed.

Have you stopped seeing your friends and family? Does your lover or husband criticize your friends and family members? Did he complain so much when you saw them in the past that you finally stopped seeing them altogether so you wouldn't have to argue with him about it? Are you ashamed to see your friends or family because of your mate's abusive behavior, and because you're embarrassed at having put up with so much from him?

Sheesh, so if you criticize her family or friends you're an abuser.  And, NAW, women never cause scenes in front of family or friends.  NEVER.

Do you believe that you are to blame for your husband's or lover's problems? Do you feel you are mostly responsible for the problems with the relationship?

Now the first sentence could be ok, as long as it had qualifiers.  But the second one is a "get out of jail free" as far as the woman having ANY responsibility as to the relationships.

Does your mate try to take advantage of you sexually or make unreasonable sexual demands on you?

I can go with this one.  As long as it asks the woman the same thing.  And of course it needs to be asked if the woman uses denial of sex as a manipulation tool.  Otherwise it's only asking 1/2 of the problem.

Does your lover's personality change when he drinks alcohol?

Ok, are they kidding?!  Just about EVERYONE's personality changes slightly when intoxicated.  But of course, the subjective precept is that men change negatively, women don't change or only become "giggly and tipsy".  Nah, there are no mean drunks out there who are female.

Does your mate use "HUMOR" to put you down or degrade you?

You have got to be fucking kidding me.  No, women NEVER cut up, character assassinate, humiliate, or put down their men.  And NEVER in public.  Never.

Does he lack the ability to laugh at himself?

Does she?  Did he "not notice" how her dress fit, or that she was getting fat and needs emotional support, or that some harmless comment made in front of friends made her fume?  And when she "wasn't laughing at herself" was it HER fault?

Notice the connections and dissonence between that question and the one directly above it.  Man = bad / woman=good.  IN BOTH SITUATIONS.

Does he find it hard to apologize or to admit when he is wrong? Does he make excuses for his bahavior or always blame others for his actions?

Oh Barf in a dog's bowl!  No, women ALWAYS apologize when wrong, NEVER make excuses for their behavior, and/or blame others (or you - or PMS) for their actions.  Never.

Does he usually get his way in deciding when and where the two of you will go?

Does she?  Is that abuse?  Women never nag a guy about things.  And of course if HE makes the decision as to where to go and what to do, and it works out badly .... does she BLAME HIM.  Unless it works out, then it was "their" decision.  Got it.

Does he control or disapprove of your spending but seem to have no problem spending on himself?

Boy, is THIS subjective.  And, let's not forget that women spend 80% of the consumer dollars.  God forbid that when that $$$ is spent the man should have the temerity to open his mouth and voice an opinion.

Then, it's called abuse.

[emphasis mine]

GIVE ME A FUCKING BREAK.

(See Assault!  We're with ya buddy)

Steven

[Roy]

LS --

Answering the following questions will help you to determine whether or not you are in an emotionally abusive love relationship.

All of the examples you listed are straight out of the feminist Duluth Model, and are employed to demonstrate strategies of "male power and control."

All the language is gendered to make sure that men are always the perpetrators, and women always the victims.

Notice that Rule #1 (though hidden) is that women shall never be held accountable, shown to be able to make choices, or described in any way except as passive, innocent victims of male aggression.

What I've long found interesting about the feminist-ideological dogma about domestic violence is that its proponents have an infantile and silly concept of power.

They refuse to recognize or deal with all the various forms of power that women enjoy and use (emotional, psychological, sexual, financial, legal, and yes, even physical) -- because to admit that women have power gives the lie to the whole charade of victimology.

The concept of emotional abuse has been so diluted and trivialized that the act of with-holding or limiting anything a woman wants becomes a form of abuse.

The kinds of experiences that Assault is having right now in weekly DV group can drive one to the brink of madness, because it's an Alice Through the Looking Glass topsy-turvy world where the counselors function as the enforcers of a fictional reality.

If you're ever facing the trip down the DV Rabbit Hole, it's best if you can view it as anthropology, a kind of field trip to a strange and bizarre feminist wacko sub-culture....  then it can be interesting, even humorous in a twisted way.

[fezzik]

Paraphrased from http://www.thenetteam.net/abused.html

1. Is your mate older, larger, and stronger and does he make more money than you do?

2. Has your mate ever made a negative comment about a family member or friend of yours, and do you spend less time with your old friends and family now that you're not single anymore?

3. Have you made up problems in your relationship and failed to convince your mate that they're real?

4. Has your mate ever asked for something sexually that you said 'no' to?

5. Has your mate ever had a drink?

6. Has your mate ever made a bad joke you found offensive?

7. Have you ever made a bad joke your mate found offensive?

8. Does your mate apologize when you think he's wrong?

9. Do you play the 'what do you want to do tonight' game with your mate, and are you ever unhappy with what you do?

10. Does he always spend enough money on you?

[Hachu]

Paraphrased from http://www.thenetteam.net/abused.html

1. Is your mate older, larger, and stronger and does he make more money than you do?

2. Has your mate ever made a negative comment about a family member or friend of yours, and do you spend less time with your old friends and family now that you're not single anymore?

3. Have you made up problems in your relationship and failed to convince your mate that they're real?

4. Has your mate ever asked for something sexually that you said 'no' to?

5. Has your mate ever had a drink?

6. Has your mate ever made a bad joke you found offensive?

7. Have you ever made a bad joke your mate found offensive?

8. Does your mate apologize when you think he's wrong?

9. Do you play the 'what do you want to do tonight' game with your mate, and are you ever unhappy with what you do?

10. Does he always spend enough money on you?

Omigod,

how can that be real!

-Do you feel like a child in the relationship, having to ask permission and apologizing for your behavior? Do you feel powerless and "less than" your lover or mate?

No

-Have you stopped seeing your friends and family? Does your lover or husband criticize your friends and family members? Did he complain so much when you saw them in the past that you finally stopped seeing them altogether so you wouldn't have to argue with him about it? Are you ashamed to see your friends or family because of your mate's abusive behavior, and because you're embarrassed at having put up with so much from him?




-Do you believe that you are to blame for your husband's or lover's problems? Do you feel you are mostly responsible for the problems with the relationship?



-Does your mate try to take advantage of you sexually or make unreasonable sexual demands on you?

*Yes, I find him wanting to have intercourse with me, his wife,

at all, completely unreasonable  :lol: *

-Does your lover's personality change when he drinks alcohol?

*who is the same drunk, as they are sober???!!!!*


-Does your mate use "HUMOR" to put you down or degrade you?


-Does he lack the ability to laugh at himself?


-Does he find it hard to apologize or to admit when he is wrong? Does he make excuses for his bahavior or always blame others for his actions?


-Does he usually get his way in deciding when and where the two of you will go?


-Does he control or disapprove of your spending but seem to have no problem spending on himself?

- A "YES" answer to even half of these questions indicates that you are in an emotionally abusive love relationship.

:lol:

Thinking if this are  the actual rule of measure

Husband and I are abusing the hell

Out of each other.

[LSBeene]

Hachu,

Yes, it IS shocking what they consider "violence", and how it is ONLY applied to men and NEVER women.

This is the stuff we MRAs are seeking to change.  These kinds of definitions are regularly used by women to exercise power, to cover their own abusive behavior, and as a divorce advantage.

Now, don't mistake MRAs (Men's / Father's Rights Advocates - us!) as to thinking we excuse or condone EITHER gender's violence, but we want the definitions to be gender neutral, for services to be equally available, and for the "only men abuse/only women are victims" stereotypes and mythic statistics to stop being put out as gospel.

Below is a link to a show many of us listen to.  This episode is about 1/2 the way down and titled:

May 30, 2004

Darkness at Noon: Soviet-Style Re-education in
State Mandated 'Batterers' Classes

Here is a link to the page: Link to Glenn's DV Show

Very early in the show (2 Minutes and 25 Seconds to be exact - I prelistened to make it easier on you    ) Glenn reads DIRECTLY from a DV shelter's handbook as to the definitions of DV (Domestic Violence).

You think WE shocked you with the above article?  Listen to the show and see what ya think.  

It's an entertaining show, Glenn is very supportive of women, but just wants men to get a fair shake in the legal system, to get equal services, and to expose what goes on in DV shelters in their current form.

I sincerely hope you take the time to listen.

Respectfully,

Steven

[Hachu]

This one listens to Glenn's archived radio broadcast at work.

Have been doing this for the past 3 weeks.

Via the miracle of Quicktime.

[LSBeene]

Ok, just trying to be helpful.

Steven

[Hachu]

Ok, just trying to be helpful.

Steven

no problemo

[The Biscuit Queen]

Fezzik reworded the list to make it much different than it was originally. While his reworded version sounds terrible, and woman may actually be interpreting the first as his version, the original version was more reasonable. He provides a link to the original.

While I hate lists like this, I think it is pretty misleading to put words in other peoples mouths, which is what Fezzik did.