Goodbye Feminism

Started by angryharry, Aug 21, 2005, 10:17 AM

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Roy

Quote
I am a male to female transsexual
...

Is there a conspiracy to kill this website?

How many more trans-neo-queer-ambivalent???? posters can we suffer?

If Dr. Evil declares that he's a woman, I'll just have to kill myself.
It's a terrible thing ... living in fear." (Roy - hunted replicant. "Blade Runner.")

sethay

Quote from: "natalie clifford barney"
Quote from: "bukowski"
Quote
If you wish to end circumcision, I'm totally with you... but please do not try to equate it with FGM, which is far more harmful and invasive.




It sure is a good thing you, as woman living in the West, had absolutely no chance of a knife cutting any piece of your genitals off for no legitimate medical reason.



Earlier today, a comment was made to me about "how would I know what it is like to have a penis... I let it go, it wasn't necessary to go into.

And now your comment. Well... it's like this. Yassee, I am a male to female transsexual, and I was circumcised at birth. And I also happened to have a vasectomy many years ago. And beyond that, I pay child support, $600 a month.

I've been where you are... the reverse is likely not true.


I am sorry, but I am a bit confused and I hope this is not inappropriate to ask, but does this mean you are actually a straight guy?

bukowski

Quote
Earlier today, a comment was made to me about "how would I know what it is like to have a penis... I let it go, it wasn't necessary to go into.

And now your comment. Well... it's like this. Yassee, I am a male to female transsexual, and I was circumcised at birth. And I also happened to have a vasectomy many years ago. And beyond that, I pay child support, $600 a month.

I've been where you are... the reverse is likely not true.






A former man being, or a man not being, a male to female transexual would not change the fact that as a man he would be at risk of having a knife being taken to his genitals and part of it cut off for no medical reason.  This also does not change the fact that a woman, born in the West, has almost abosultely no chance of that being done to their genitals.

natalie clifford barney

Quote from: "sethay"


I am sorry, but I am a bit confused and I hope this is not inappropriate to ask, but does this mean you are actually a straight guy?


Noooo, I am a transsexual, which makes me a woman and a dyke.
o im gonna grab my soul
And leave my ego at the door
I'm gonna open up my eyes
So, c'mon sing along if ya wanna
Cry if ya hafta
Lean back into your lover's arms
Grab the hand of the person
Standing right next to you
Show them we are not afraid of who we are

~ Melissa Ferrick

Conspiracy Theory

Quote from: "natalie clifford barney"

Nelson Mandela



I wonder if you would still like Mandela if you knew exactly how many accused rapists he got of the hook?

Kind of a 'Harper Lee' thang goin on, but hey.  

:D
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." ~ Mark Twain

natalie clifford barney

Quote from: "bukowski"







A former man being, or a man not being, a male to female transexual would not change the fact that as a man he would be at risk of having a knife being taken to his genitals and part of it cut off for no medical reason.  This also does not change the fact that a woman, born in the West, has almost abosultely no chance of that being done to their genitals.


Um, I believe it was mentioned I was circumsised? And you are correct women in the west don't face this issue, but a whole bunch of women around the world do. It's brutal. And I've expressed support for ending the male variety, so we really have nothing to debate.
o im gonna grab my soul
And leave my ego at the door
I'm gonna open up my eyes
So, c'mon sing along if ya wanna
Cry if ya hafta
Lean back into your lover's arms
Grab the hand of the person
Standing right next to you
Show them we are not afraid of who we are

~ Melissa Ferrick

SouthernGuy

Quote
Is there a conspiracy to kill this website?


I knew and two of the mods knew. I left it up to them to say anything, as I felt it wasn't my place. I had a slight amount of cognitive dissonance over not  letting people have the whole picture. I left the ball in a certain mods court as to whether it would ever be brought up in debate if it somehow put an SYG'er in an awkard position.

The mod, correctly I believe, left it up to nelle. When nelle goes back to her homebase, she will have no stories of being ostracized or villified by those "evil" or "whacko" MRA's. Only reasonable people who are fed up with what is happening to our rights. I think this is a plus for us...

SG

Conspiracy Theory

Quote from: "natalie clifford barney"
What you seem to forget is that the exact same thing is happening, except you are observing but two, and we are observing many. ;-)



Who are you addressing this too, and wtf do you mean?
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." ~ Mark Twain

bukowski

You said not to compare FGM with MGM and that is what is done when one is against routine circumcision.  It has no medical purpos therefore it is mutilation, thus MGM.

SouthernGuy

I for one, am happy I'm circumsized.

SG

Conspiracy Theory

I guess that answers the question of if "she's hot or not".
Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover." ~ Mark Twain

Roy

This thread may be a testimony for why the men's rights movement is such a joke.

Can you imagine this thread as a transcript before Congress?

No offense implied.....

Just a lickle reality check.
It's a terrible thing ... living in fear." (Roy - hunted replicant. "Blade Runner.")

TestSubject

Quote from: "natalie clifford barney"
Quote from: "TestSubject"
Quote from: "The Purple Dinosaur"
What do you wish to accomplish? Is it simply to stop feminism? Or is the goal a bit more altruistic and noble?


Who are you to say stopping feminism isn't altruistic and noble?   :?


If you believe Valerie Solanas is the incarnation of feminism, why yeah, I can see why you would be a bit unnerved... but that is fallacy, trying to demonise femonism... powerful forces do not much care for change, even if it is to equality and nothing more.


That doesn't answer my question.

TestSubject

Quote from: "Roy"
Can you imagine this thread as a transcript before Congress?


I'd accomplish more by slapping them in the face with my dick.

Russ2d

In order for one to debate the issue, one first has to frame the issue to
be debated. Your view of pc is quite a bit different from mine. Yassee, pc
for me is about basic respect.. we don't put people down for skin colour,
orientation, gender, religion, ethnicity...

yet you see it as fascism with roots in communism, a dichotomy if ever
there was one. Not to say your idea lacks merit, merely stating a surface
observation...

funny that black people, and homosexuals, and feminists are thought to have
arisen based on a corrupt legal system, since it was a corrupt society that
put them down to begin with. OK, I will grant some leeway in evolving from
agrarian to industrial society, but for African Americans, surely we can
blame society for how they ended up being considered less thans.

So why is it respect for each other is such a tough thing? Why is wishing
for us to live together in harmony fascism? Is there something inherently
wrong with African Americans, with women, with dykes that they cannot be a
part of a greater society? How does my partnering with another woman
adversely impact you?

I can tell you how evangelist Christians who seek to declare me second
class citizens adversely impact me, but there is no corresponding
reciprocation. And my issue with them ends when they leave me alone.


I am all for living together peacefully. PC however is not the way to do
it. It may be respect to you but it's censorship and thought control to me.

I want feminism to die its rightful death and for respect of sex
differences and sex roles to return.


How so? What sex differences? Heterosexual intercourse requires one
partner to have a penis, the other a vagina... but I don't think you use
your penis at work... so genitalia is irrelevant in a work environment. If
strength is needed, than strength is a requirement. I know of no woman that
would argue against legitimate requirements... most I know in the military
don't wish there to be separate standards.

Aside from sex, what requires sex differentation? Surely a man can parent
as well as a woman, and both are competent in the workplace, so why this
need? Why not let water seek it's own level individually? Not all men have
desire to be macho dudes, nor all women housewives. Why can't each of us
pursue our own dreams and interests?


A woman's primary role is mother/nurturer

A man's is protector/provider


Um, that is an outdated social construct. Now it may be you are
comfortable in that role, and no problems there... do what works for you.
Just don't impose that on others who see life differently. I'm a huge
believer in each of us reaching our full potential, being all we wish to
be. If this be your dream, and if someone shares it, fine with me. And we
should make sure our young are free to follow their own path.



We disagree. You call it an outdated social construct, I call it obvious
biological reality.


Culturally I would let the chips fall where they may for normal occupations
with the understanding that men and women naturally choose different paths
and have very different abilities. No quotas, no affirmative action,
nothing but merit.

Affirmative action has it's place, though as time goes on they become
less and less necessary. For the most part, women have made inroads into
the workforce, but we still have serious issues facing African Americans, a
systemic problem going back 150 years, because we didn't do it right then.
We have a duty to find solutions, and yes, African Americans have a duty to
find the solutions and work toward them. I'm an admirer of Nelson Mandela,
who believes the way to go is through education, and indeed that is the
case... but we have to help a culture that prides itself on education
develop, and we have to see to it the tools are there... that class sizes
are much smaller than now, kids thrive on individual attention... and by
the way, this is the approach that will help young men refocus on
education.



Affirmative action creates resentment for the simple reason it punishes
those who have not committed the crime. I am in favor of helping out those
based on class, not race. If most of the poor in a particular area happen
to be black then so be it, but it shouldn't come in the form of an outright
quota.

As for the death professions- military, police, and fire departments etc
they should be exclusively all male for obvious biological reasons and
should be celebrated as such with no apologies to anyone.


No way. It's that simple. You meet the qualifications, you're in, no
gender restrictions in any way, shape, or form. Women are half this
country, with a corresponding place in it, participatory or otherwise. Any
new draft should be of men and women.

By the way, women are gaining ground on men in things like marathons, and
I've seen some suggest that a time will come in the future when women might
pass men in such events, because biologically they are predisposed to
having more endurance. We are a ways away, but the differences have
narrowed markedly in thirty years. And look at how far women have come in
one generation of basketball, with no mentor network.


The facts do not agree with you. The U.S., Canada, Israel and Britain as well as the former Soviet Union and
some recent stuff out of the Netherlands have done sex based performance
research. Cutting to the quick, the very top percent of women score only within the
bottom range of men. In other words for every level that a woman performs
at, no matter what that level is, there are tens of thousands of men who
can do it better. The qualifications in the military are bullshit and
everyone knows it. They can set the standard anywhere they want, a normal
healthy woman cannot compete with her relative normal healthy male
counterpart.

As far as the endurance thing goes, that's a myth that has creeping around
since the late 70's. It's long been debunked, but many books do not update
either their sources or the info gathered from said sources so this fallacy
reappears once in a while. The rationale for the myth was actually rather
absurd. You are also wrong about marathon times but this again is all academic. The truth is the very best female athletes are the way they are because they were exposed inappropriately to male hormone in utero. They excel because of male cells. Add to this the many 'females' who use synthetic Testosterone and what you have is someone who can no longer rationally be called 'female'.

Male cells+male hormone= male characteristics. Conversly female cells+female hormones= female characteristics.


I do thank you for taking time to share your views, this makes it a whole
lot better than throwing water balloons back and forth! Obviously I
disagree, but nonetheless admire you for putting in the effort.

No problem

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