The Guardian on Men's IQ

Started by neonsamurai, Aug 26, 2005, 12:42 AM

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neonsamurai

From my favourite paper the Guardian.

Quote
Psychology's odd couple join battle of the sexes

Women have lower IQs than men, say apostle of political incorrectness and self-proclaimed feminist

Sam Jones
Friday August 26, 2005
The Guardian


It has been the subject of countless workplace arguments and marital rows, and now two of the unlikeliest scientific bedfellows claim to have conclusively proved which of the sexes is more intelligent.
The pair's controversial study, which will be published in the British Journal of Psychology in November, states that men's IQs are on average five points higher than those of women.

One of them has long maintained that men are more intelligent than women, believes that white people are cleverer than black people and has called for the procreation of the "underclass" to be kept in check.

The other describes himself as a feminist and is fretting that his conclusions will undermine decades of female social progress.
Their study, a meta-analysis of 57 other studies, suggests that there are three men to each woman with an IQ of more than 130, and 5.5 men for each woman with an IQ above 145.

Paul Irwing, senior lecturer in organisational psychology at the University of Manchester, and Richard Lynn, emeritus professor of psychology at the University of Ulster, discovered that there was no difference in boys' and girls' intelligence until the age of about 14. But after that point, they argue, a difference of almost exactly five IQ points emerges which seems to remain constant throughout adulthood.

"I did approach the study with a certain amount of trepidation," Prof Lynn said yesterday. "Anyone who attempts to overturn the consensus will have to be confident that they are right. Then there's the added component of being politically incorrect."

Four years ago, another study by Prof Lynn found that men's IQs were three to four points higher than women's. He believes men are more intelligent because they have bigger brains. Asked why girls consistently outperform their male peers at school, he said: "When you're talking about better exam results like GCSEs and A-levels, this is partly a function of intelligence and partly a function of motivation and conscientiousness.

"Many of today's exams involve coursework, and women are more conscientious than men. This explains why girls are doing well at this level despite their lower IQs."

Of the increasing number of women in senior positions in academia and the corporate world, he said: "I guess more women are being elected to the Royal Society because it is partly under pressure to do so because people point out that there are about 10 times as many men as there are women in these organisations.

"Plus there are more women going into higher education now and becoming career-conscious. Going back 50 or 80 years, women didn't think about careers because they were just mothers."

Prof Lynn's views are not shared by his research partner.

"If it doesn't sound odd, I would like to describe myself as a feminist," Dr Irwing said.

"I am trying to investigate the psychological differences between men and women, and sometimes you get findings that you don't really like, but it's better to have a well-informed debate rather than people just airing their views."

Melissa Hines, professor of psychology at City University and author of Brain Gender, said: "The study seems to be a reiteration of what Richard Lynn has been saying for many years now, but most of the research would not point to this conclusion. I think the most important point is that there are different tests used to measure intelligence and some favour women while some favour men."

Adrian Furham, professor of psychology at University College London, was more receptive to the study. "Richard Lynn's work is well known. What he has been saying is what has not been able to be said, but it will not come as a surprise for most academics or people who work on intelligence."

Dr Irwing sounded less sure yesterday: "To be honest I'm not sure I have done the right thing, but in the end I thought it would be dishonest to suppress it."

Scientific reason

The world according to Professor Richard Lynn


On the academic differences between boys and girls

"To get an A grade at GCSE, a moderate IQ and conscientiousness suffices. To get a first at university, one needs a high IQ. There is a lot of fuss about boys failing at school and what can be done about it. The answer is nothing, so long as school grades are substantially determined by coursework.

"When it comes to the most demanding measure of ability - winning a first-class degree at Oxford or Cambridge - males do much better"


Mail on Sunday, July 2004

On opposition to his research into intelligence


"A consensus paradigm is not easily overthrown no matter how strong the evidence against it, as Galileo famously found, so I have not been surprised to find people are still asserting that there is no difference in intelligence"

Letter published in the Psychologist, August 2005

On the threat of the underclass


"My argument is elitist. The professional and middle classes are generally superior in regard to other classes, particularly the underclass, in terms of intelligence and moral character.

"Natural selection has broken down. In centuries past, it did the job for us of weeding out those with low moral character or low intelligence. There was a high mortality rate. Now the underclass survive and have children. Obviously some measures need to be taken"


The Guardian, December 1996

On science and race


"If we are talking about people who believe there are genetic differences between the races, then I am definitely a scientific racist"

The Guardian, May 1996

On race


"My major discovery is that the Oriental peoples of East Asia have higher average intelligence by about five IQ points than Europeans and peoples of European origin in the United States and elsewhere. I first published this finding in 1977 in a paper on the intelligence of the Japanese.

"In 1991 I extended my work on race differences in intelligence to other races. I concluded that the average IQ of blacks in sub-Saharan Africa is approximately 70"
Dr. Kathleen Dixon, the Director of Women's Studies: "We forbid any course that says we restrict free speech!"

lkanneg

On the threat of the underclass

"My argument is elitist. The professional and middle classes are generally superior in regard to other classes, particularly the underclass, in terms of intelligence and moral character.

"Natural selection has broken down. In centuries past, it did the job for us of weeding out those with low moral character or low intelligence. There was a high mortality rate. Now the underclass survive and have children. Obviously some measures need to be taken"


Um, yikes.  Yikes, yikes, yikes.   :shock:
quot;Remember no one can make you feel inferior without your consent."
--Eleanor Roosevelt

"Something which we think is impossible now is not impossible in another decade."
-- Constance Baker Motley

"Don't compromise yourself. You are all you've got."
--Janis Joplin

The Gonzman

Lynn may be morally repugnant, but arguing the datum he produces based on his political opinions is what is commonly called "Argumentum ad Hominem."
Yea, though I walk through the valley of the Shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, for I am the MEANEST son-of-a-bitch in the valley.

Peter

Here the Guardian has a more typical tiltle. Imagine if they had written

"Women 'grasping at straws' over intelligence claims"

Unthinkable.



Men 'grasping at straws' over intelligence claims

Donald MacLeod
Thursday August 25, 2005

Guardian Unlimited
Claims that men are more intelligent than women were met with scorn today - as girls once again trounced boys in this year's GCSE results.

A paper due to be published in the British Journal of Psychology claims to have established a five-point difference in IQ scores between men and women.







There are more men with very high IQs and this explains why more men than women win Nobel prizes or become chess grandmasters, argue Richard Lynn, of Ulster University, and Paul Irwing, of Manchester University.

"This is a last desperate stand by men to show they are superior. They see they are sinking and are grasping at straws," said Sue Povey, of University College London.

Prof Lynn is regarded with suspicion by many academics for his claims that white people are more intelligent than black people. Three years ago he even attempted to prove that light-skinned African-Americans were cleverer than their dark-skinned peers.

On this occasion, his co-author is Dr Irwing, a senior lecturer in psychology, who told the Times Higher Education Supplement: "My politics are rather different from Richard's and from my point of view, I would prefer it if we were wrong." But he added that a five IQ-point difference could not be easily dismissed.

Looked at from a population perspective, it meant there were three men to each woman with an IQ above 130, and 5.5 men for each woman with an IQ above 145.

Dr Irwing added: "These different proportions of men and women with high IQ scores are clearly worth speaking of and may go some way to explaining the greater numbers of men achieving distinctions of various kinds for which a high IQ is required, such as chess grandmasters, Field medallists for mathematics, Nobel prizewinners and the like."

The awkward fact that women now outnumber men at every level of educational achievement except doctorates - today 8% more girls than boys gained GCSE passes at grades A-star to C for instance - has forced the authors to look for other explanations. They say there is evidence that at the same IQ level women are able to achieve more than men "possibly because they are more conscientious and better adapted to sustained periods of hard work", and say that IQs of about 125 are enough to allow access to all levels in the labour market.

"The small male advantage in IQ is, therefore, likely to be of most significance for tasks of high complexity, such as complex problem solving in mathematics, engineering and physics, and in other areas of high spatial ability," said Dr Irwing.

Prof Povey, a human geneticist, said IQ tests were not a pure test of innate ability. Better educated people did better and women over 30 were likely to have worse educational opportunities.

She said there were differences between men and women, who seem to have a better verbal memory and be better at multitasking. More men have autism and there could be a link with obsessional concentration of the kind needed to win Nobel prizes.

"There could well be differences, but I remain to be convinced that there is a difference in IQ. If women had the same chances there might be just as many women Nobel prizewinners," said Prof Povey.

Simon Baron-Cohen, of Cambridge University, who first proposed a link between autism and the "male brain", has dismissed Prof Lynn's attempt to enlist him as an ally.

"I wish Prof Lynn had read the relevant section of my book, The Essential Difference, which concludes that overall intelligence is not better in one sex than the other."
EducationGuardian.co.uk Guardian Newspapers Limited 2005
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Galt

Quote
"This is a last desperate stand by men to show they are superior. They see they are sinking and are grasping at straws," said Sue Povey, of University College London.


It sounds like she's in the ultimate death battle with men.

If you ever feel like you have a lot of problems in your life, remember that you aren't married to HER.  That may cheer you up.

Mr Benn

What an evil bitch.

Nevermind, she looks quite old:

http://www.hugo-international.org/mission_presidents.htm

They'll be burning her soon!
ww.CoolTools4Men.com

D

Quote from: "Galt"
Quote
"This is a last desperate stand by men to show they are superior. They see they are sinking and are grasping at straws," said Sue Povey, of University College London.


It sounds like she's in the ultimate death battle with men.





:jump:


.

TestSubject

I'm telling you, men just need to quit.  Dump the world in women's hands.  They're so proud of themselves, so let them have it.  I'll stop grasping at straws, and women can do all the world's work that they insist they're so much better at.

It'll be one easy life...

...for me.   8)

Mr Benn

Quote from: "TestSubject"
I'm telling you, men just need to quit.  Dump the world in women's hands.  They're so proud of themselves, so let them have it.  I'll stop grasping at straws, and women can do all the world's work that they insist they're so much better at.

It'll be one easy life...

...for me.   8)


Feminist womyn are so reckless and self-delusional that they'd think they could too.
ww.CoolTools4Men.com

Peter

Quote from: "TestSubject"
I'm telling you, men just need to quit.  Dump the world in women's hands.  They're so proud of themselves, so let them have it.  I'll stop grasping at straws, and women can do all the world's work that they insist they're so much better at.

It'll be one easy life...

...for me.   8)


It will be a hard life.

I agree to it only if it happens far away from me, somewhere in the feminist utopia.

Love, peace, understanding, no weapons, no war, no army, no police, no border control, sisterhood, equality, free immigration, looting of the assets of the West, medieval technology, medieval justice, medieval punishments.
BM-NByw7VE2PwjfTtsVdeE5ipuqx1AqkEv1

Galt

Quote from: "Peter"
Love, peace, understanding, no weapons, no war, no army, no police, no border control, sisterhood, equality, free immigration, looting of the assets of the West, medieval technology, medieval justice, medieval punishments.


Agreed, especially with the looting of the assets of the West.  If feminists ever got their dream, they don't understand that men would just quit producing.  Same old stuff we saw in the East Block & the Soviet Union, but with the added notion that the women in the new "Polit-Bureau" may have some problems controlling things when men as a whole finally ... finally ... just get sick of them and chuck chivalry and the old behaviors towards women to the wind.

I know that sounds radical, and hopefully things would never get that far (although strange things have happened in societies in the past).  A lot of women also recognize this ... and feminists wonder why there is resistance to their ever-further demands (just go to the NOW website to see the new "CEA" proposal etc.).  They are just spoiled children stomping their foot when mature men and women start saying "STOP" to them.

Double Jeopardy

It's like belonging to a special elite club where all the members can hear voices in their heads and those who cannot are not allowed in. When you ask the members of this elite organisation what the big hubbub is, they say "I hear voices in my head, and they don't like you".

:lol:

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