Question for lkanneg

[contrarymary]

lkanneg.

As much as I would like to read all the posts here, I simply don't have the time or the ability to concentrate.  You are very eloquent, but a bit verbose (as I can be, so please don't be offended).  

I was wondering if you could answer a question, then - as succintly as possible - which is an honest one, and asked with much respect and open-mindedness:

You said you are a feminist, right?  If so, why?  Why? What still needs to be accomplished?  I honestly can't think of anything, but then again, I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Again, this is an honest question.  

But please - can we keep it short?  My attention span is crap these days.
Bullets would be helpful.....

[lkanneg]

lkanneg.

As much as I would like to read all the posts here, I simply don't have the time or the ability to concentrate.  You are very eloquent, but a bit verbose (as I can be, so please don't be offended).  

I was wondering if you could answer a question, then - as succintly as possible - which is an honest one, and asked with much respect and open-mindedness:

You said you are a feminist, right?  If so, why?  Why? What still needs to be accomplished?  I honestly can't think of anything, but then again, I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Again, this is an honest question.  

But please - can we keep it short?  My attention span is crap these days.
Bullets would be helpful.....

 I will make a numbered list just for you.  (thanks for asking in such a nice way, I really mean that )

1.  I believe in the social, economic and political equality of the sexes, which is the definition of feminism.
2.  I am deeply appreciative of all the things feminists of past generations have done to make it possible for me to have the life I have and I feel as if I am identifying with them by also calling myself a feminist.
3.  There are still jobs (few)  that women are barred from solely because of their gender.  There are still jobs (more numerous) that women must struggle with prejudice, from mild to violent, to enter into and succeed at, solely because of their gender.  There are still double standards in society that result in women suffering solely due to their gender (for instance, the sexual history of a woman is viewed very differently from the same sexual history if possessed by a man).  Etc. etc.  I oppose these things.
4.  The large strides forward in equality that women have achieved, are very new in the history of humankind.  Only a fool would take them for granted and assume they're unassailable.   "The price of freedom is eternal vigilance."  -Thomas Jefferson.  

Okay, it wasn't *that* short, but hopefully it wasn't *too* verbose.  Let me know!  

[contrarymary]

Thank you so much!  But I can't respond now....but do know how much I appreciate you dumbing down your posts for me.

[lkanneg]

....but do know how much I appreciate you dumbing down your posts for me.

That's GOTTA be sarcasm.    (If it isn't, I didn't dumb down anything!  Just offloaded my tendency towards verbosity.  You seem pretty bright to me...)

[TestSubject]

That's it?  Nothing actually vital or critical?   :shock:

I apologize for invading the thread but lets be honest here, feminists insist that men's rights activists have no purpose when they use the "boohoo I get called a slut when I act slutty and he/she doesn't" justification, what makes this any different for feminists?

What are those few jobs?

[contrarymary]

contrarymary wrote:
....but do know how much I appreciate you dumbing down your posts for me.


That's GOTTA be sarcasm.  (If it isn't, I didn't dumb down anything! Just offloaded my tendency towards verbosity. You seem pretty bright to me...)

Honest, it was not.  Really.  I don't have the ability to concentrate anymore.  I appreciate your post - but we're baking a pie right now...tomorrow, then, and thanks - and I'm not being sarcastic, just honest in my assessment about myself.

[bukowski]

I'm most certain that Ikanneg will say, no, it isn't so.  But still I'd like to confess something that I have personally wondered once or twice with all the time she has to post and respond at this single web site alone.  I sometimes wonder if she is secretly a middle class housewife with a lot of time on her hands.

[lkanneg]

I'm most certain that Ikanneg will say, no, it isn't so.  But still I'd like to confess something that I have personally wondered once or twice with all the time she has to post and respond at this single web site alone.  I sometimes wonder if she is secretly a middle class housewife with a lot of time on her hands.

LOL, no.  Just a slow period at work, and I'm not posting on any other websites presently.  That slow period is ending next week; I'm going to be offsite a good deal, so you will see somewhat less of me.   Lots of my neighbors are stay-at-home moms; maybe I can get one of them to take over.  Then again, the majority of them also appear to be homeschooling Christians with about a zillion kids, so I'm not sure how they'd take this board nor if *they* have any time on their hands.

[lkanneg]

That's it?  Nothing actually vital or critical?   :shock:

Well, *I* think those issues are vital and critical.  Nobody else has to though.

I apologize for invading the thread but lets be honest here, feminists insist that men's rights activists have no purpose when they use the "boohoo I get called a slut when I act slutty and he/she doesn't" justification, what makes this any different for feminists?

Where have I ever said that men's rights activists have no purpose?

What are those few jobs?

In the Army women cannot serve in the following: infantry, armor, cannon field artillery and short range air defense artillery.
In the Navy women are excluded from Submarine Warfare, Special Warfare (SEAL) and ratings particular to submarine service such as fire control technician, missile technician, and one aspect of sonar technician.
The Marine Corps assignments closed to women are infantry, armor, field artillery, security force guard protecting nuclear material, and several positions related to armored, amphibious, assault units and fleet antiterrorism security teams.
Air Force positions closed or restricted are Combat Control, Special Operations Forces, Rotary Aircraft, TAC Pararescue, and Weather assignments with infantry or Special Forces.

[dr e]

Pie!!!!! :1blue1:

[dr e]

In the Army women cannot serve in the following: infantry, armor, cannon field artillery and short range air defense artillery.
In the Navy women are excluded from Submarine Warfare, Special Warfare (SEAL) and ratings particular to submarine service such as fire control technician, missile technician, and one aspect of sonar technician.
The Marine Corps assignments closed to women are infantry, armor, field artillery, security force guard protecting nuclear material, and several positions related to armored, amphibious, assault units and fleet antiterrorism security teams.
Air Force positions closed or restricted are Combat Control, Special Operations Forces, Rotary Aircraft, TAC Pararescue, and Weather assignments with infantry or Special Forces.

Do you think that any of the above named jobs might have any good reasons for not allowing women?  Do you think that women should be able to be hired for any job?  Do you think that the dumbing down of standards for jobs like the fire department in order to allow women to be hired is a good thing?

At this point men sustain 93% of occupational deaths.  Should we work towards 50/50?

[lkanneg]

In the Army women cannot serve in the following: infantry, armor, cannon field artillery and short range air defense artillery.
In the Navy women are excluded from Submarine Warfare, Special Warfare (SEAL) and ratings particular to submarine service such as fire control technician, missile technician, and one aspect of sonar technician.
The Marine Corps assignments closed to women are infantry, armor, field artillery, security force guard protecting nuclear material, and several positions related to armored, amphibious, assault units and fleet antiterrorism security teams.
Air Force positions closed or restricted are Combat Control, Special Operations Forces, Rotary Aircraft, TAC Pararescue, and Weather assignments with infantry or Special Forces.

Do you think that any of the above named jobs might have any good reasons for not allowing women?  

No.

Do you think that women should be able to be hired for any job?  

Yes.

Do you think that the dumbing down of standards for jobs like the fire department in order to allow women to be hired is a good thing?

No.

At this point men sustain 93% of occupational deaths.  Should we work towards 50/50?

Allowing women to take the jobs that they desire and are qualified for but forbidden to do so solely because of their gender would be a step in that direction.  That question is a bit nonsensical though--rather like saying, "4 out of 5 forcible rapes are of women.  Should we work towards 50/50?"  Presumably what we want to do is work towards eliminating occupational deaths--and rape--regardless of the gender of the victim.

[bukowski]

I think it's funny.

Men are forced into the military, navy, etc. when men's bodies are needed as a resource to fight for resources.  And before that force is intiated men are forced to sign up for that draft with legal consequences if they do not do so.

Women are oppressed from not being allowed in certain areas of the military, navy, etc...... :boohoo:

[dr e]

I think it's funny.

Men are forced into the military, navy, etc. when men's bodies are needed as a resource to fight for resources.  And before that force is intiated men are forced to sign up for that draft with legal consequences if they do not do so.

Women are oppressed from not being allowed in certain areas of the military, navy, etc...... :boohoo:

Bukowski I was thinking the same thing.  And as politically correct as our armed forces are today I would bet they have some good reasons to restrict certain applicants.  Reminds me of the issue Gonzo talks about where women simply don't have the strength to toss a hand grenade far enough to not blow themselves to smithereens... but lkanneg thinks that women should be able to get hand grenade throwing jobs.  

Here's a clue, women and men are different and some things men do better than women and some things women do better than men.  My guess is that the hiring you are complaining about is based on performance qualifications not on gender.  Similar to the fire department problem that you seem to agree with.  Go figure.

[lkanneg]

Here's a clue, women and men are different and some things men do better than women and some things women do better than men.  My guess is that the hiring you are complaining about is based on performance qualifications not on gender.  Similar to the fire department problem that you seem to agree with.  Go figure.

Nope.  Women are forbidden to do those jobs solely based upon their gender.

Though I spect you've hit upon a major point, though probably not the one you intended.  It almost seems...like men really can't *bear* the thought that a woman can meet the same physical and mental standards for a job.  After all, if she really *couldn't,* then there wouldn't be a need to bar her based soley upon her gender, would there?  No woman would be able to pass the entrance testing for the job.  Does anybody *really* think that women are excluded from those jobs because there is *no* woman that can meet the same physical and mental standards as the men..?  And are men ever going to be brave enough to let themselves find out, either by raising the standards in the cases they've been lowered for women or by opening the jobs and keeping the same standards?