in need of help

[Laboratory Mike]

So, here's the deal,

I was in my communications class today, and we had impromptu speeches. In this case, we got a quote on a card, got to think about it for one minute, and then had to give a one-minute speech. Most were mundane, such as "I like Ike." But I got the special card. The quote on it was, or was very similar to:

If all men who enjoy pornography "came out of the closet," there wouldn't be a man left over the age of ten.

I do not remember the very end of it, but it was either the statement above or "wouldn't be a man left over the age of ten in that closet." Either way, my speech was about how all men like pornography. And I had to state this quote in front of both men and women. I kept a good spirit about it and made a rather funny speech about how both men and women look at it and how people trying to stamp it out look the most, but I was embarrassed. Very much so. It was like I was being forced to say "I like porn" to the audience.

So, here's my question, should I take this up with the professor, and how? Should I ask him to remove that quote card from the stack, so that other students will not have to use the same quote int he future activities? I am also planning to make my case via email, and CCing the department chair and associate chair for undergrads in the email. What do you think is the best course of action?

[dr e]

Just make sure that they have a card that says:

If all women who enjoy romance novels "came out of the closet," there wouldn't be a woman left over the age of eight.

Porn is to men as romance novels are to women.  BFD.  

Men are shamed for liking porn, women and girls are encouraged for liking romance novels.

[Laboratory Mike]

Just make sure that they have a card that says:

If all women who enjoy romance novels "came out of the closet," there wouldn't be a woman left over the age of eight.

Porn is to men as romance novels are to women.  BFD.  

Men are shamed for liking porn, women and girls are encouraged for liking romance novels.

While making a girl state "Romance novels are, essentially, porn for women" would be a bit funny in the sense that it would turn the tables on this situation, I don't think that's what I'm looking for. People should not be shamed in their classes, a communication/technical writing class at that! While we play the "what happens if it's reversed" card rather often here, I am not going to suggest shaming people for their alleged involvement (in my case, I do not look at porn, but essentially had to say that I did) in unscrupulous activities as a way to take care of the problem.

[Sir Percy]

I might, if sharp minded enough in those circumstances - have pointed out that:
men are visually stimulated and therefore porn is a natural exension of a natural urge;
that shaming over a natural inclination is shameful in itself;
That the activity seems to be found in every culture;
that closets are made by specialist closet makers, amateurs of which might also be in the room;
that closets are useful in that what goes on in them do not interfere with others;
that women have an equally vitalised natural inclination to be looked at and admired for their sexuality;
that the internet is awash with women who take their clothes off and desport themselves sexually - including it seems many at college, maybe one or two even in this room! - who can be seen as just as complicit in porn;
that these women seem to be from every culture too;
that men may buy, but it is women who sell and make personal gain;
that supply and demand generally go hand in hand;
etc......

Blow embarrassment, confront the truth. A chap could have fun poking fun.

[Laboratory Mike]

Percy,

To the end you are implying, this particular issue can't be brought up again in that context. However, the course is focused around an estradiol (estrogen) patch for women, so in that case I can always let this one go, and instead prepare myself for some poking and prodding later in the class. I know there is going to be something...

If you're wondering, the course itself is about writing papers for scientific journals, writing invention disclosures for patents, and preparing media reports. The professor happens to be working on the development of patch-delivered drugs, and we are doing coursework based on research he has done on the aforementioned estradiol patch. It should be a good course, the temporary embarrassment and shaming notwithstanding.

[devia]

The one problem with that is romance novels have a very limited audience, (those few smart enough to read tabliods, yet stupid enought to want to, and that's about it). Same people reading them are the same people reading whatever those gossip/conspiracy rags are at the grocery check out counter. I'm happy to say I've never really met one.

Second problem is that in romance novels the central character is the heroic male figure, not the wanton male slut/toy.

Porn is visual, not mental. Hence it has a greater audience. Personally I read a couple when I was about 12 or so... (Not really.. unless you include the Mandingo series into that). Other then that... why?

I will say though that good porn can be interesting.

[whome112]

It's a pity you didn't think to target your speech to misandry. "This quote with its negative and false view of men is a good example of the serious misandry problem we have in our culture." etc ...

I'd take the matter up with the prof from a straight up 'this is sexist" point of view.

whome

[Rob]

Wouldn't it have been a hoot if you would have just gotten up and said:

"Yup, ALL men like looking at porn. It's a good thing too because if it wasn't for men wanting to see women naked, we might not have anything to do with them at all."

Then smiled, and taken your seat.

Hey, if your prof asks a stupid question, are you obliged to give an intelligent answer?

[johnnyp]

It's a pity you didn't think to target your speech to misandry. "This quote with its negative and false view of men is a good example of the serious misandry problem we have in our culture." etc ...

I'd take the matter up with the prof from a straight up 'this is sexist" point of view.

whome

I think that would have been a good way to approach.

Turn the speech from men and porn to stereotypes of men.

Men oppress women in the workplace which results in women only making 76% of a man's income - facts: Men work longer hours, work in more dangerous jobs (93% of workplace fatalities are male).  Men pursue jobs that pay more.  When you take into account work experience, education, and specific jobs, women actually make a little more than men.

Domestic violence - the stereotype is that all men are violent to their women.  Facts - women are as likely to be violet to a partner as men.  The CDC reports that a substantial percentage of DV has the woman being the aggressor.  The vast majorities of men protect their women and are willing to put themselves in harms way to do so.

Deadbeat dads - the stereotype is that many men refuse to pay child support.  Facts - the vast majority of men pay child support regularly and on time.  The few men who do not pay child support fail to do so because of not having a job/money to pay.  Some men protest the mother's interference with visitation by paying late, or withholding payment.

Men are not good parents - this stereotype leads to men seldom getting custody of their children.  Ninety percent of the time courts assume that women make better parents than men.

Life is not as hard on girls as boys - facts:  85% of all suicides of people between 15 and 24 are male.

It is not acceptable to make silly stereotypical statements about minorities or women.  When is society going to stop making stereotypical statements about men?

[johnnyp]

Since you asking for help after the fact - this is what I would do:

I would say to the professor the following:

In liked the card you gave me that said "all men like porn".  I think I have some suggestions for more speech topics along those same lines.

"All blacks like fried chicken and watermelon"

"All women are hysterically emotional"

"All artists are gay"

etc.

[CaptDMO]

The one problem with that is romance novels have a very limited audience, (those few smart enough to read tabliods, yet stupid enought to want to, and that's about it). Same people reading them are the same people reading whatever those gossip/conspiracy rags are at the grocery check out counter. I'm happy to say I've never really met one.
.

Actually, yes, you have. Its just not many will confess it.

Here's a little bit of interesting information- but don't take my word for it.

What daily publication has the highest circulation?
Weekly?
Monthly?
In the US? the UK?AUS?CAN?France?Spain?Russia?Japan?China?

What magazines with gratuitious scantily clad females, or Fabio, on their covers have the highest circulation?

What's the ratio of "romance/passion" fiction sales compared to, say...
fantasy/science fiction?

Why are some publications sold at market checkout counters and on racks, while others are sold at book sellers?

One could do extensive research, or simply ask the folks that sell these things. (and maybe the local Post Master!) I'd like to suggest that Officially Authorised Govt. Data would be suspect here (as always)!

I won't even go into targeted cable television here!
Mail order and subscription is another realm as well.

And of course, what is "I know it when I see it/read it" pornography?
I propose, for this conversation, (perhaps others) that the American movie/television ratings system be the referance standard. I'm not familiar with other standards but I believe the American standard has the fussiest  "grades" of assumed judgement.

So, here's my question, should I take this up with the professor, and how?

Ask your professor more about the importance of packaging  "triggers" for the targeted sales demographic for products that are essentially unessential, and universal truths practiced  by the advertising industry despite widespread desire  of high intellectual self image.  Also ask if  insight from psychatry (NOT a psycology) on the mechanics of addiction might be in order. A conversation with a political speachwriter (NOT a debate wonk), or playwright may be in order as well.

Turn the speech from men and porn to stereotypes of men.

Absolutely! As a matter of fact, turn it into a conversation about the fact that stereotypes exist, based on culmitive observations of   demographic groups, for an inescapeable reason!

I suggest - "While this communications statement card may  present males in a sociologicly dimmer light in a contemporary classroom full of "inquireing minds", the facts supported by sales due to marketing, or public opinion due to clever oration, for the last 2500 years show that there are distinct (as well as self percieved) differences between men and women, rich and poor, mountain and valley dwellers, skinny and fat, and strong and weak, and that an appeal to the basest of these perspective interests wll elicit the strongest incentive to exchange ones assets, however obtained, to "own" a precieved self-image reinforcement."



Bear in mind-(I ASSUME) this statement card was not presented as a judgement, merely as a "talking point". It would probably serve better as a point of gender recognition rather then gender debate.

[no2fembots]

It is not acceptable to make silly stereotypical statements about minorities or women.  When is society going to stop making stereotypical statements about men?

... when pigs fly...

[The Biscuit Queen]

Actually, it is not a small number of women who read romance. Nora Roberts, the top selling romance author sells 12 books a minute, every day, for the last 20 years. That is not an insignificant number. 3 of the top 20 selling books right now are romances. 11 out of the top 100 are romances. That puts it at around 10%. Are 10% of videos rented out or bought porn? are 10% of web sites porn? Or should I say are any of the top selling movies or most hit sites porn?



I think since romance is a far more socially acceptable outlet than porn, you will see more romance.

Also, Sue Monk Kidd, Maeve Binchy, and others are authors who are good writers, write books that while male bashing and usually missing good male characters, are interesting to read, have good plots and great female characters. However when push comes to shove they are romances, they are books which fulfill desires in women, emotional porn. Lets be frank, women want the emotional orgasm, we want to be teased along the book and end with a rush that makes us place our hand on our chest, sigh deeply with a tear in our eye.

I just don't petend it is any more sincere or deep than getting off physically to made up women.

[TheManOnTheStreet]

I read a Danielle Steele once.... a long long time ago.  Just to see what my wife saw in her.  I would equate these sort of stories as almost soft porn or dare I say erotica.


BTW, it was a bad read too....  He grabbed me in his sweaty arms... his pulsing muscles wrapped around wy waste, I felt his manhood press against me.  He wanted me.  He needed me.....

Oh yes you beast!  Take me!  


GAG!

Al

[TerryGale]

I would let the Professor know that speech really put you on the spot and made you uncomfortable and try to elicit his/her reasoning.  I would talk to him/her before making it a campaign.  

I think I could have made a sppech on that subject today.  The professor might have been surprised at what I said.  I don't know how I would handled that assignment as a somewhat sheltered 20-something.  Maybe the assignment was actually about "thinking on your feet, out of your comfort zone"  Good luck, whatever you do.